If you become President of ICAI new?

This discussion is constructive appraisal of Accountancy in India and Accountancy Bodies have on the business. The focus will be from point of view of public interest and other stakeholders. Members are expected to discuss from point of view of current legislation prevailing in India and also contrast with international practises. Discuss on MRAs and MOU between the accounting bodies.

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This discussion is constructive appraisal of Accountancy in India and Accountancy Bodies have on the business. The focus will be from point of view of public interest and other stakeholders. Members are expected to discuss from point of view of current legislation prevailing in India and also contrast with international practises.

This is a open forum. Please share your opinion in professional manner or else face moderation.

Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby cmadevarajan on Fri Nov 15, 2013 10:01 am

can someone please explain what does one mean by "core" "industry"?
Thanks and kind regard
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Devarajan Swaminathan & Co.
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby sudhakaricwai on Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:29 pm

I do not think we should restrict Costing/Cost Audit just to public companies , in fact it should go beyond corporate world (including govt expenditure audit )as it is not just protecting investors interest also protecting public in large, Govt policies, Companies future.

No point comparing CMA profession with Financial Accountants/Company Secretaries who are there just for compliance.

Thanks,
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby rakeshkataria on Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:44 pm

Institute should start project with government for effective implementation of the social welfare policies,

1. Project for study of Cost/benefit analysis of MENREGA scheme.
2. Project for railway costing system
3. Project for Postal department services
4. Project for study of Cost/Benefit study for subsidised health schemes of Govt. of India
5. Project for State public transport system (Rajasthan Roadways have very good system of costing)

So many areas we can contribute to Nation.

Now Price control system is almost gone, and also subsidies in fertilizer, sugar, insecticides and petroleum products is going to be scrapped.

So, We need to change the strategy, and should not depend on MCA, we should involve with other department of Govt. of India and work with them and develop effective system for implementation of Govt. schemes. once system is develped than govt. need services of the professionals for the monitoring of the directions of the schemes.
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby cmadevarajan on Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:01 pm

so damn the bird on hand and hunt for the non existent two in the bush. In the process also damn the reason why you existence was created in the first place.

Compliance is there only for financial accountants and company secretaries not for us we are different, really?. Ok, how different should we be and how should we be different, some insights please.

When you strategise have different aspects and dimensions in mind not necessarily all (also not possible) for the limited purose of this debate.

People who are seeking to be different also please let us know the background. Are you from the industry or practice and also if you are from the industry what is the portfolio that you are handling. This is just to get some insights about how many CMA's are actually a part of the strategic department of a company, how many are purely accountants (doing compliance within the industry), how many are hadling the treasury aspect. and of course how many are in costing department of the company?

It will help to understand. At least those vocal here can start with.
Last edited by cmadevarajan on Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Thanks and kind regard
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Devarajan Swaminathan & Co.
Cost Accountants

aligning costs with strategies
Mission, Vision, Values
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby bvprabhakar on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:09 pm

It is sad to see Indian CMA profession facing crisis now & then. Govt of India seems to be listening to other rival Institute on the fate of our profession. Other Institute professionals, notably ICAI-old are interfering with our profession and making all out efforts to stall the progress. Our Institute seems to be no match for these rivals in terms of lobbying.

I agree that ICAI-New is no different from other Institutes in as much as it is also created under Act of Parliament. If there is a mandatory financial audit for ICAI-old & secretarial audit for ICSI then why not mandatory cost audit for ICAI-new. Why the ill-treatment and step-motherly attitude from GOI?

I agree that we are primarily accountants and our core competency is in cost & management accounting, cost audit & other accounting areas and must receive regulatory support for the profession to sustain.

If the GOI does not want to support our profession fearing others, it can declare this openly and close down our Institute instead of playing with lives of thousands of members & especially students who can then look for more profitable avenues.
Last edited by bvprabhakar on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
लागत और प्रबंधन लेखाकार
விலை மதிப்பீட்டு மற்றும் நிறுவாகம் கணக்கர்
దారణ మరియు నిర్వాహకం గణకుడు
ಮೂಲ್ಯ ಮತ್ತು ನಿರ್ವಾಹಣೆ ಲೆಕ್ಕಿಗ
لاگت اور انتظام لیھاکار
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby himalendubose on Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:22 pm

If the GOI does not want to support our profession fearing others, it can declare this openly and close down our Institute instead of playing with lives of thousands of members & especially students who can then look for more profitable avenues.


I fully agree. This will only happen if the greedy CCMs collectively resign.

Career of 600,000+ students and 60,000+ members needs to be justified and saved.
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby cma28321 on Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:51 am

The GoI is ready to support. But our leaders matter, just try to analyze. The fruits of some of the earlier leaders' efforts (for example Mr B M Sharma) have been apparent later.

But I find we have very few competent leaders in comparison with our sister Institutes, the reason is simple we elect on partisan basis rather than institute/profession centric way. this is the case from Chapter to CC, when you vote like a tribal clan rather than a professional, you cannot expect things to go global, they will just remain local, well, not even that, since our rivals have gone national long back and now they are trying to go global.

Now, food for thought, just call up each of the CC, RC and Chapter Council members and ask how many of them really earn bulk of their income on costing, cost audit and allied areas - you will be astonished by the result - I am sure, some of us will go crazy. Costing is a fashion apparel for them, not suitable for every day dressing.

I was told many of the chapter chairmen/ RC/CC have PCMA certification as an ornament only and none of them actually live on it, they have other sources of income and a chair at the chapter/RC/CC is just a fashion statement for them.

Is this the case of other Institutes??? Now, you will stop wondering why I called this question hypothetical. Or should I say irrelevant?
Last edited by cma28321 on Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:54 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby kushal on Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:31 am

when you vote like a tribal clan rather than a professional, you cannot expect things to go global, they will just remain local


Very true!!!
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby bvprabhakar on Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:23 pm

There was chief guest from our CC(and he was also past president of ICSI). he openly said in that meet his heart always beats for ICSI even now (after becoming ICAI-CMA CC member), then how we expect our CC would take care of CMAs interest when we rarely find real cost accountant on the board.


I think as long as any CMA member is committed totally to the profession, his additional qualification or membership of CA or CS or any other Institute shall not be a deterrence. I do not know who the CC is referred to but if he had said his heart beats only for ICSI then he shall be shown the door in the next election. I can see CMA Raman & CMA Gopalakrishnan though CA were also PCMA and have been totally committed to CMA profession and contributed immensely. Nobody is restricting CMAs to confine to one qualification and it is up to the individual and at the end of the day, which profession you chose and your committment to contribute shall be more important. Personally I would chose a CMA as CC even if he is holding additional qualification of CA/CS if he is totally committed to CMA profession. It would be unfair to attribute unwarranted motives to the persons holding multiple qualifications unless it is apparent as in the above quoted instance of ICSI CC.

Apparently, there has been lot of confusion on which direction the Institute should take. Someone says that CMA profesion is not accounting profession and shall not claim Statutory avenues. Some one says Cost Management is more important than cost accounting. cost audit etc etc. There should be a honest & healthy debate among members on this. Personally, I feel that being ours being a statutory accounting body, Government should provide exclusive mandatory avenues for members to sustain especially when other two Institutes enjoy such privileges. And I would not restrict this only to cost audit but it should be as much as possible - it could be excise audit/VAT audit/stock audit/internal audit/tax audit. Already new company law has provided some certifications & valuation venues to CMAs. The moment we say that CMAs should also be given tax audit, and other additional practice areas, someone jumps and says we are deviating from our core area. What is the problem in having additional practice areas? Now company law authorizes CMAs to certify the company formation documents. Is company law our core area? Shall we ask GOI to withdraw those certifications areas since they do fall in our core area ambit? Ultimately, as we hold on to our core area, any additional practice areas should be welcome.
Last edited by bvprabhakar on Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
लागत और प्रबंधन लेखाकार
விலை மதிப்பீட்டு மற்றும் நிறுவாகம் கணக்கர்
దారణ మరియు నిర్వాహకం గణకుడు
ಮೂಲ್ಯ ಮತ್ತು ನಿರ್ವಾಹಣೆ ಲೆಕ್ಕಿಗ
لاگت اور انتظام لیھاکار
コストと管理会計
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Re: If you become President of ICAI new?

Postby bvprabhakar on Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:27 pm

Draft Rules related to Cost Audit will be hosted on the website soon for comments/suggestions


- MCA website now says.

Last date for submitting comments/Suggestion for four tranche of Rules has been expired. Ministry of Corporate Affairs thanks to all the esteemed stakeholders for submitting their valuable comments/suggestions. Draft Rules related to Cost Audit will be hosted on the website soon for comments/suggestions


http://mca.gov.in/

This gives hope that cost audit provision is safe.
लागत और प्रबंधन लेखाकार
விலை மதிப்பீட்டு மற்றும் நிறுவாகம் கணக்கர்
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ಮೂಲ್ಯ ಮತ್ತು ನಿರ್ವಾಹಣೆ ಲೆಕ್ಕಿಗ
لاگت اور انتظام لیھاکار
コストと管理会計
التكلفة ومحاسب الإدارة
Kosten-und Management Accountant
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